Tim Campbell: ‘Solely two of us knew what The Apprentice was!’

Welcome to the second sequence of Small Enterprise Snippets, the podcast from SmallBusiness.co.uk.

In the present day’s episode options Tim Campbell, an entrepreneur and the primary winner of The Apprentice again in 2005. He discusses his views on apprenticeships and the concept behind one in all his extra uncommon enterprise ventures.

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Good day and welcome to Small Enterprise Snippets, the podcast from SmallBusiness.co.uk. I’m your host, Anna Jordan.

In the present day we now have Tim Campbell, an entrepreneur and the very first winner of The Apprentice again in 2005.

Since working for Lord Sugar, Tim has launched Shiny Concepts Belief, a charity for deprived younger entrepreneurs and Alexander Mann Options, a expertise acquisition agency.

We’ll be speaking about what it was wish to be within the first crop of candidates on The Apprentice and the best way to give interviewees helpful, constructive suggestions.

Anna: Good day Tim.

Tim: Hello, how are you, Anna? Good?

Anna: Yeah, very effectively, thanks. A little bit of a grim day however doing alright. How are you?

Tim: Oh, if we didn’t have the climate to complain about, what would we now have?

Anna: Precisely! It’s the essence of being British.

Tim: It’s sadly, however let’s hope for higher tidings to return.

Anna: Superior. Proper, for a little bit of context, we’re recording within the Alexander Mann Options workplaces in the present day – in a sound sales space, which may be very good.

Tim: It’s certainly. However one of many fascinating issues that amazes me about London and may be very thrilling, is the juxtaposition between the previous buildings we are able to see and the brand new cranes you’ll be able to see all over the place.

Anna: Precisely, yeah. It’s fantastic seeing the structure of the brand new vs the previous. You wouldn’t suppose they work collectively, however they do.

Tim: That’s the factor about London – we make it work. That sings to the essence and the entrepreneurial nature of people from the UK.

My mum was an entrepreneur, however she didn’t name herself an entrepreneur. She was simply making ends meet, because it had been. A Jamaican immigrant to the nation who had three kids and introduced all of them as much as be comparatively profitable. However she at all times underpinned that with working onerous, going out and incomes a dwelling. And London has at all times facilitated that and I suppose the inspiration for me in lots of the issues I do is my mum in that she came to visit with all the talents and attributes however didn’t have the information, contacts or mentors to have the ability to do this.

Do you suppose your mum didn’t name herself an entrepreneur as a result of she didn’t undergo the formal avenues of getting a grant or a mentor?

Tim: Undoubtedly. She simply didn’t have time to fret concerning the nomenclature, she was simply centered on the outputs and I believe that one of many issues we discuss with the those that we both mentor or assist is to strip it right down to its naked requirements.

A number of persons are very within the profitable outputs of getting in enterprise. They need the cash, they need the accolades, they need the title and we now have to begin on the very starting: ‘What downside is it that you simply’re fixing? What’s your enterprise? Then we get some clean seems they usually say, ‘We simply need the cash on the finish. Can’t you simply give me that?’ And I say, ‘Nicely, no truly – there’s a course of to it.’

I believe with my mum and me and the individuals we try to assist, we try to encourage them to not deal with what the title is as a result of titles are for company environments, whereas if you’re a enterprise proprietor it doesn’t matter, notably if you run a micro or small enterprise, you do all the pieces.

However primarily, you’re centered on the output and delighting the shopper. So long as you retain that on the forefront of your thoughts, then you’ll be able to benefit from the pats on the again and the celebrations of what you’ve accomplished. However by no means lose sight of why you’re on this and that’s to please a buyer and make them comfortable, after which get them to present you cash because of this.

The factor I’d like to speak about is your time on The Apprentice. You had been on the very first sequence earlier than anybody even knew what it was.

Tim: A very long time in the past, neither did we! We didn’t know what it was. For the 14 contestants on the primary present, there have been most likely solely two individuals who did the investigation to seek out out precisely what The Apprentice was, which is a bit silly to confess, however I’m going to be very trustworthy.

Anna: Was one in all them you?

Tim: Yeah.

Anna: Oh actually?!

Tim: No, I didn’t. I used to be very naïve, I truly utilized for a job with the primary focus being to get the six-figure wage. That’s what I wished. As a result of [the programme] wasn’t as fashionable as it’s now and didn’t appeal to the hundreds of thousands of individuals watching each single episode, so it was a special beast.

However once I utilized, it was about securing a wage that may take care of my household. And naïvely, I simply utilized considering that 1) I used to be going to work with a fantastic British entrepreneur within the then Sir Alan (as he’s now Lord Sugar) and a pair of) it was a sizeable a number of on the cash I used to be incomes in the mean time. I believed, ‘What might I lose?’ Little did I realise what you possibly can truly lose, however that’s why I carried on with the appliance and fortunately it was a constructive consequence.

Yeah, that’s it – as a result of individuals who apply now see it as a platform for a enterprise concept that they could have and clearly you get the funding on the finish.

Tim: Appropriate. I suppose the factor for me is that the larger alternative for a present like that, aside from shouting and screaming on the contestants who don’t need to do the dreadful issues they generally should – or popping out with the ridiculous one-liners they appear to repeatedly do yearly with out fail – is studying from Lord Sugar himself.

He’s a superb entrepreneur within the truest sense of the phrase, in that he can spot issues, give you options and ship true worth, not simply to traders, however stakeholders, clients, in what he would be capable to ship.

From what I’ve seen, there weren’t as many zingers within the first sequence as there have been afterward. What else is totally different between then and now?

Tim: In all probability as a result of I used to be simply boring. On the primary sequence, I bear in mind the entire contestants. All of us had been actually aggressive – we simply wished to win. What we agreed on very early, was that the way in which we might safe victory was by not shedding activity and never falling out with one another. If we labored as a crew, we’d truly do extra. That will need to have been so annoying for the tv producers as a result of that’s not what they need to hear, however that’s what we had.

After we went on activity, we had been going to be well mannered and civil. And after we had been on activity, we had been going to be aggressive, however not devious to the purpose the place we’d damage different people. That wasn’t on our agenda. And that sung to our values – notably me and Saira – who had been challenge managers quite a lot of occasions. Our values had been that you possibly can win with out being detrimental to individuals. And I believe that’s generally misplaced, notably when individuals discuss enterprise typically, the place the picture that folks get is ruthless, belligerent character that kills all people and steps on the heads of minor individuals to get to the place they’re. And there are some people who find themselves like that in enterprise, however the overwhelming majority of individuals I’ve labored with – both on the present or in enterprise in the true world – simply need to survive.

Anna: These relationships are so essential.

Tim: It’s vital. What we took from our sequence was that the ability of robust relationships helped you go additional.

As you stated, the prize within the first sequence was a job with Sir Alan, again then. You arrange his well being and sweetness division at Amstrad.

Tim: It was a really fascinating journey. You had been requested on day one to give you a well being and sweetness product. And I believed, ‘What is that this?’ And what I noticed it as was a check. What we had been making an attempt to do – and we did efficiently, was replicate different multi-level advertising processes. We bought different ladies to promote the merchandise to different ladies. It was a really fascinating two years I spent.

The entire gambit of enterprise was concerned in that individual challenge. I have a look at it prefer it was a real-life MBA. It was phenomenal when it comes to studying and expertise. I nonetheless rub cream on the again of my hand now and say, ‘Ooo, isn’t that pretty?’ as a result of I perceive the way it was all made.

How was the reception of MLMs again then? Now we’re seeing a backlash, notably with corporations that don’t have a fantastic status, make false guarantees, are fairly exploitative.

Tim: Yup, and I believe persons are proper to see a backlash towards these ones who don’t ship towards what they are saying they’re going to. The important thing factor that I realized from Lord Sugar was to ship in your guarantees.

The merchandise that we placed on had been about empowering individuals to make a income from the merchandise that we had already generated. However we had very clear outputs, a really clear rewards construction and had very clear advertising, which had no false pretence behind it. And the advantage of happening a tv programme which had multi-million individuals viewing it’s that you simply get held to account in a short time when you don’t do what you say you’re going to do.

So fortunately, the entire work that we did was regulated, it was checked and verified by unbiased individuals and delivered towards the guarantees. What we had been actually centered on was them studying about enterprise whereas probably producing some earnings for themselves in addition to utilizing a very good, extremely potent and efficient product.

When you had been to return on The Apprentice now and win the funding (£250,000) moderately than the job, what would you do with it?

Tim: Very fascinating. I believe if I had been to do one thing in the present day it’d be round synthetic intelligence and a few type of tech. You have a look at among the trade sectors on a medium scale that are accelerating in extra of 20laptop each single yr and also you’re instantly gravitating in the direction of use of tech, notably within the monetary sectors. The fintech market has been superb.

I believe there are some actually fascinating performs within the insuretech area and the edutech area. Training and folks insuring towards threat are by no means going to go away.

When you have a look at among the fast-growing companies in the mean time, they’re offering ancillary providers behind companies, so courier servicing, ensuring which you can ship consultancy recommendation and steerage into enterprise. Or anyplace round tech when it comes to selling enterprise propositions. These are the areas I might’ve give you a proposition for him to present me some cash for.

I do know you’re supportive of apprentices. From a small enterprise proprietor’s perspective, we’ve seen that some are delay hiring apprentices as a result of they don’t have time to coach them or they will’t afford them. What would you wish to see that may make issues simpler?

Tim: I believe for small companies you’ve bought to make the choices that are actually essential to your organization. You possibly can’t simply observe on. It’s bought to be best for you as a enterprise. The problem with a small firm is when you make a mistake the affect is far larger than in an even bigger firm the place you make a mistake, it may not be proper, however you’ll be able to transfer round and also you’ve bought the sources to soak up that.

Small companies should make actually vital selections round can they tackle an extra wage as a result of if you tackle an apprentice, it’s not a free useful resource. In my view, you need to pay them the dwelling wage – and the London wage when you’re within the capital. Then you definitely’ve set to work into the equation how lengthy the worth add is to you as a enterprise proprietor. They’re going to should study the ropes and get off the bottom earlier than they develop into of worth to you as a small enterprise.

And the coaching that comes with an apprenticeship – how precious might that be to an organisation in making an evaluation? It’s not for each small firm, with the quantity of supervisory ingredient to an apprenticeship programme, the sources might not be there for a small enterprise to have the ability to go alongside that journey but. But it surely’s one thing that ought to positively be on the agenda and possibly for the smaller to medium-sized companies which are rising, versus the micro companies who’re in the beginning.

I’m going to take what is often seen as a extra morbid flip right here. I perceive that you’re the director of an organization known as dying.io.

Tim: Sure, I’m certainly. And moderately than scaring a lot of individuals, it ought to fill them with pleasure. What we now have accomplished, and once I say we it’s me, my co-founder Paul Wiseall and our chairman, Tom Ilube, have come collectively to begin an organization which is utilizing synthetic intelligence to assist individuals higher put together for the inevitable.

And the moderately stunning title of ‘Dying’, just like the likes of Virgin or Google, makes you surprise what that is about, the place is it coming from and it’s a little bit of a shock issue. We wish it to stay in individuals’s minds that this is among the final taboo areas that try to be speaking about. As a result of the entire trade is a dialog which occurs behind closed doorways, in hushed tones, and nobody actually needs to discuss it.

There are such a lot of alternative ways to speak about dying. What we at dying.io have accomplished is utilise expertise that will help you reside without end. We’re in a position to take the important parts of you as a person and inform your story, inform us the numerous moments of your lives and utilise expertise to create a digital individual out of these recollections, which others can work together with.

Is that verbally or in writing?

Tim: Each! For the time being, we now have a platform which lets you speak utilizing typed phrases again and ahead to your avatar. However the developments are rapidly incorporating voice into that. So very very like you may such as you may inform a speaker to show the lights or the music on in your home, you should have the power to speak to your self through a type of gadgets as effectively.

Anna: Oh, that’s sort of eerie.

Tim: In a method, I can perceive why individuals suppose, ‘Oh my gosh, I don’t need that, the place would that come from?’

However on the similar time, bringing it to again enterprise, I had the privilege of talking to the top of the Chinese language Takeaway Affiliation. It was very fascinating – I didn’t know one existed – however one does! What he stated is that you simply’ve bought lots of people who’ve come over as immigrants to this nation and labored actually onerous to construct up improbable companies inside each single main metropolis on the planet. They’ve accomplished that to facilitate a greater life for them and their kids. What occurs although is that these kids go to improbable colleges, go off to school, and should determine that they don’t need to run Mum and Dad’s Chinese language takeaway. What occurs to all of that data? What occurs to all of that perception round the way you choose inventory, how you buy stuff, the way you arrange a advertising marketing campaign to get individuals to do stuff? That data has to go someplace in any other case it simply passes with the person.

It’s additionally a possibility for us to ensure individuals have their lives so as: have you ever bought the appropriate insurance coverage in place? Have you ever bought the appropriate safety for your loved ones going ahead? We have now the power to let individuals do this in a pleasant, pleasant, social approach.

Yeah, from what I noticed I just like the holistic strategy of it, particularly with the weblog. It’s touched by so a lot of in the present day’s matters like quickly advancing expertise, sustainability, gender identification.

I just like the tone as effectively – usually with conventional funeral care suppliers and planners there’s a proper and sombre tone the place once more, on the weblog, it helps breaks the stress round, as you say, a taboo topic.

Tim: We had a fantastic dialog with an outstanding company known as Prepared Ten, began up by an excellent buddy of mine, David Fraser. He was the one company that picked up the potential of this when it comes to how you possibly can flip this right into a constructive dialog. Their concepts round how you possibly can actually grasp a troublesome topic like dying – you need to discuss these items as a result of they’re not going to go away.

We need to take the stance of not making mild of the dialog, however in lightening the dialog round topic issues that should occur. Like, when you bought sick, what would occur? What’s your blood kind? I don’t know – most individuals don’t know! When you don’t know what your blood kind is otherwise you don’t know when you’ve bought any hereditary ailments, we now have a option to seize that and share the true essence of who you might be moderately than the curated bit that you simply may do by means of different social platforms.

I believe there are some fascinating moral questions round grieving, the way in which that folks’s recollections are held. As a result of we contact so many individuals, you may want me to return again alive, however I would’ve been actually horrible to another person who doesn’t need me to proceed on dwelling. What are the moral implications of all of these?

However for us as a platform, we need to give that possession and choice over to the person. The place you’ll be able to signal as much as have this delivered in any approach, form or kind based mostly on what you are feeling these round you want. It’s not for us to behave as choose and jury round that, however it’s going to be a really fascinating improvement to see how far individuals need to take it.

Nicely, I’d love to speak about this a bit extra, however I need to transfer onto our final matter. You’re an advocate of the Combat for Suggestions marketing campaign, encouraging employers to present interviewees good high quality suggestions. In your opinion, what makes high quality, respectable suggestions from an employer?

Tim: I believe it’s extremely essential that employers to know that they’ve a duty to depart candidates with a very good candidate expertise from their useful resource course of. Why is that essential? I used to be at all times informed that it’s essential to say goodbye in a pleasant approach moderately than simply say hiya in a constructive approach. These individuals will inform one other ten individuals precisely the way you handled them. It’s crucial from an employer model perspective to make it possible for staff – whether or not they’re profitable or not in going by means of a course of – depart with a very good feeling.

And the easiest way to depart with a very good feeling is to be informed ‘No, however that is how you possibly can enhance’. As employers, I believe all of us have a duty to boost the extent of our candidates, and I believe the one approach you are able to do is alert them to what they will do higher sooner or later.

Let me make it clear, as a result of there are many very huge employers who’re saying, ‘Cling on a second, Tim – we see a whole bunch of hundreds of individuals yearly for our placements.’ Sure, that’s true, there are lots of people coming by means of. It could not be unattainable to place a construction in place which says to people, ‘You may not get direct verbal suggestions from each individual you spoke to however we are able to a minimum of spotlight the areas that we didn’t choose you on.’

There are such a lot of candidates who discuss filling out an software, taking the time to nurture a CV and make it bespoke to that employer, write the overlaying letter, do all the pieces mandatory, and don’t hear something – not even a ‘no’. That’s a really detrimental seed that’s been planted round that model and the worth that they place across the individuals who work together with them. And for me, simply to have the ability to say, ‘No, however these are the areas you fell down’ is as highly effective as a half-hour cellphone name with a person to stroll them by means of precisely what they might do to enhance. Now, the dimensions of when you are able to do that will alter relying on how far they’ve gone by means of a course of and the way senior the precise position is. I don’t thoughts that.

And the opposite factor to consider from an employer’s perspective is that it’s a two-way course of. You possibly can get some free advertising analysis from people who’ve interacted with you they usually can inform you what they discovered and that may enable you to develop and get higher as effectively. You possibly can create a superb marketing campaign, appeal to a improbable funnel of expertise, however you don’t know until you’re asking them how they’re receiving it.

I believe suggestions is such a small factor to do which may have such a huge impact on how individuals understand that model and the way they’ll go and work sooner or later. So, if any individual has an enormous downside presenting data in a approach, inform them, assist them to be higher and also you by no means know, they could come and be just right for you sooner or later due to that suggestions. Plant good seeds; give good suggestions.

Anna: Nicely, that looks as if the right place to finish it on, so I’ll wrap up there. Thanks ever a lot for approaching the present, Tim.

Tim:  Thanks a lot for having me, Anna. Let’s hope that the solar is shining now in London and elsewhere and that each one of our companies enhance. Thanks very a lot for having me.

Anna: It’s been a pleasure.

You could find out extra about Tim at timcampbellhq.com. You may as well go to smallbusiness.co.uk for extra data on apprenticeships and grants. Keep in mind to love us on Fb @SmallBusinessExperts and observe us on Twitter @smallbusinessuk, all decrease case. Till subsequent time, thanks for listening.